NITROUS OXIDE ( nos / n2o ) advice forum

Hello NOS Forum!!!!

I have been researching nitrous kits for a while and finally took the plunge and purchased the SB150i6 kit that is being customized as I type this up! My first time ever playing with nitrous so I decided to go with the WON kit in order to keep it British..lol.... My car is a 2015 Jag XF-Sport 3.0L SuperCharged. It is running a custom tune and oversized crank pulley, Varex active exhaust, TCP custom intake, and 200 cel cats. I am making 475 bhp at the moment.My goal after the kit is installed and tuned is to get 450 to 475 at the wheels with a 100 wet shot.

Because of the way my intake manifold is set up, I had to go with a direct port system right off the start. I am working with Dave (can't say enough about how patient he has been throughout the whole process so far !!) and we are close to putting together a totally sik direct port system. Anyways, just wanted to introduce myself. Will be posting pics of the install when the kit arrives.

-Cheers

Hi and Welcome!

You couldn't have bought better!

Your spec sounds impressive already, can't wait to see some photo's of the install

Thanks !!!

I see in your sig that you have owned the Mondeo....My first Jag was the X400 (X-Type). I totally loved that car. It was a blast to drive!!! From what I understand, it shared alot of the drivetrain and suspension with the Mondeo.

Yep, still got them

Mines the ST TDCi Estate and she's got the ST220.

Yes, Both Jag and Ford share a lot of the same bits, even engine components as my EGR Valve is from a Jag as it was cheaper???

Absolutely love them though!

Glad you made it to the forum, Raul.

Keep up updated on the Jag. It would be most helpful to post as many pics as possible in order to guide you through the installation process.



And bagpuss, I haven't seen you around these parts in a long time.

Hell man...even my 2015 has FoMoCo stamps over lots of the engine bay and many of the internals also. Ford supplied many of the parts for Jaguar up until the TaTa acquisition. The '16 year model is the last of the Ford sourced engines for Jaguar. They have moved to the new Ingenium engine that was developed in-house.

HEy fellas...If any of you would like to chime in on this I would appreciate the input. The kit that is going on my Jag has two 6-way d.b's for the fuel-nitrous lines. Problem is that I am having trouble figuring out how best to route the stainless steel tubing. I am attaching a model of how I think the lay out will be...but as you can see it is all over the place. I need to clean it up, while somehow maintaining same size pipe lengths.

actually...this layout looks promising.....nothing but 90 degree bends and four 110 degree bends. All lines are exactly equal length

square base

Avoid using sharp bends at all costs, Raul. The sudden change in direction will cause a flow imbalance regardless of the line length. You must use smooth radii in order to achieve the best distribution. I will send you some info regarding piping flow.

Thanks or the PDF Turbobox....I re-worked the layout and applied parabolic curbs to the square base and came up with this layout. All of the pipe lengths are still the same length, but now there are no sharp bends going into the intake. When I begin bending the lines, I will temporarily secure the d.b.s on a plywood base and draw the parabolic curbs onto the wood base and bend the pipes to suit.

The PDF explained alot, but I am wondering should I also get a restrictor for the fuel line? I was reading the installation instructions and it mentioned a restrictor being included for the nitrous side, but nothing for the fuel. Is the fuel not affected enough by the elbow connection? I will be using the MaxyX2 to apply a delay to the nitrous pulseoid so I suppose that will counteract the lack of a restrictor on the fuel pulseoid.

There is no need for the restrictor on the fuel side because the momentum is far less than the nitrous side, therefore the fuel distribution will be even.

The nitrous delay is to allow the fuel to reach the outlets at the same time as the nitrous does. The is due to the difference in pressure between the two, therefore the time it takes to fill the volume of the pipework. The higher the flow rates of the two, the higher the differential and the more critical the pipe lengths.

You can set the delay to it's max for a smoother onset of nitrous. If the engine rich bogs, then the nitrous delay is too great and needs reduction. I doubt that would be the case for you, though.

On to the next step....

The 3.0L already runs a colder plug than the 5.0L engine. Due to their location, it will be really hard for me to check the plugs for color changes after the kit is installed.

Chris at VAP checked with his contact at NGK and was told that the next stage colder plug they offer for the Jaguar XF 3.0L is (NGK LKAR8AI-9). These plugs were chosen after discussing my NOS plans with my tuners (Velocity AP).

After reading some of the posts on this forum regarding plug choice when running nitrous, I am a little hesitant and confused. The plug is an Iridium type. I am buying one today to get a look at it because the pictures from the NGK website show a much much longer threaded portion than what I found on the Amazon website.

I am currently checking AFR using a OBDII bluetooth scanner and the DashCommand app. I think it is pulling data from the UEGO sensors just upstream of the cats. Currently, I am putting down right at 363 WHP and my AFR tells me I am running in the 10.5:1 range when I am at full throttle in fourth gear. After talking with Chris (Velocity AP) he suggested I install a dual wideband O2 sensor kit to tune the car after the nitrous kit is installed.

Can I bump up jetting using AFR data? or will checking plugs after the initial 25 shot run be the only way to check for issues?

BTW....how long does shipping take from the UK? The kit was ordered last Thursday. Should I expect it to arrive this week?

Picture from NGK website:

So I was looking at everyone's screen-names and noticed mine looked out of place...since WankerBoy2000 was already taken...I am now Da'JagFather!!!

While I wait for my kit to ship, I will enjoy another one of my many breaks from actual work and take you back to little Sicily back in 2004. A young JagFather looking to impress the local cowgirls went and got himself a shiny X-Type. He had so many ...many..many...good times in that car. The little X-Type couldn't pull that hard on the road, but it was a sure bet, panty droppin' car...oh I miss my youth...and my hair, and my X-Type .....

...so DaJagFather decided to marry one of those panty droppin' ladies (stupid, stupid JagFather) and have a kid (the best thing EVER...even better than catching waves!!). Little did he know that said pantydropper was a guy...lol...just kidding...she was a evil witch who placed a spell on DaJagFather and made the DaJagFather miserable for seven horrible, wasted panty droppin' years. So, in order to be happy, He figured he should get himself a fat-cat XJ and left the sexy X-Type for the evil witch to drive. The V8 was such a nice improvement over the low powered X-Type, but lacked the sexy-ness....which the DaJagFAther could not understand...since DaJagFather was in the car...then the car should, by defacto, become sexy like the DaJagFather!!! Try as he would...the XJ just didn't fit...a few years passed and DaJagFather overcame the evil spell and divorced the evil witch who was disguised as a princess but had turned into kind of a minger once DaJagFather got sober. Anyways.... He divorced the witch, but she cast her evil spell on the judge. DaJagFather lost his XJ and had to sell the house and give her half of everything .....DaJagFather then went ape-shit, spending money uncontrollably and one night wrecked his beloved X-Type......but DaJagFather persevered !!!! He remembered how to be cool and is now with DaLeggyBlonde and they happily bang in their new home....well...DaJagFather could not be DaJagFather without his beloved Jaguar...The F Type was so tempting...but, being a responsible father, he had to make a choice. Enter the Italian Racing Red , Sport Package, Fully loaded, bad mutha XF. Because DaJagFather could not afford the XFR, he has decided to turn his 3.0L XF into a sleak middleweight with heavyweight power......enter Da'Wizards Of NOS !!!!! (hey Wizzy... when is my kit getting here...."waiting on powdercoated cylinders"!! WTF!!!...go shake those cylinder painting fairies down...or send me a uncoated one!!!...lol)...anyhoo...I am now DaJagFather. Gotta go!

(hopefully) the last dyno before WON:

There is no torque curve because I went to a shop that specializes in GM (Corvettes, Camaros). They did not know what to do with an exotic cat. I usually dyno at a shop in Austin, Tx. that specializes in European import tuning but didn't feel like driving 300 miles. The guys at the shop didn't know what to make of this Jag. They finally were able to get three pulls, but couldn't figure out how to record the torque curve, but the HP numbers fit right in line with the mods I have made. It is an increase of 32 HP from my last tune before I installed the lower crank pulley and matches up with the claimed numbers that Velocity AP states for the tune + lower pulley.

I can handle the PIA part of it, but I have COP units and in order to access these things you have to remove a lot of things. I don't mind doing it, but it's not practical to do on the side of the road after a WOT run. I guess I will have to go to a tuning shop with a dyno in order to get the kit dialed in

Still have to get a bottle heater, a nitrous transducer, a nitrous pressure switch, a fuel pressure switch.....then I upgrade to REVO valves!!!

Only non-WON part on this kit is going to be an electric bottle opener.....but with the MAXY X2...do I really need one? I should be able to leave the bottle open all the time. Is this an option?...lol...I need to have as many of these things worked out before the kit arrives.

Nitrous itself might be cheap, but running it in your engine safely is definitely not!!!

Are you telling me that the WON bottle will not work with this bottle opener (Nitrous Express 11107 Nitrous Bottle Remote Opener Kit)!!!

Because the reason my kit has not even shipped yet, is because they are waiting for the cylinders to arrive from the powder coating place. I would rather just get my own bottle if that is the case. Thanks for letting me know this ahead of time. I am glad to hear that the bottle doesn't have to be turned on and off all the time though.

Waiting for the kit to even ship is worse than getting a lap dance...

BTW.....What is the difference between the Max Extreme V2 and the X2???? I am looking over the install and wiring instructions and they reference the V2 in some cases and the X2 in others.

As I understand the install of the X2 controller right now I will be:

1. Using connections L5 - L9 and L11
2. Using connections R2,R3, R9(can connect later).
3. I will be using standalone dual wideband O2 sensors w/gauge, so it's nice to see that it can be incorporated into the controller through the R14
input.

The rest is still a mystery...Don;t know how to connect the controller to receive the relevant data it needs to trigger activation, etc. (R10, R11, R12). My Jag is an automatic, so David said I needed the X2 to utilize the auto-time or auto-rpm drop setting to detect gear change. Which terminal is that function attached to? and more importantly...where does it go...lol...Hopefully, most of the questions regarding install can be taken care of before the kit gets here (I suppose that's the bright side of the kit not having shipped yet ).

Regarding the REVO valves, I agree it is overkill, but really this kit is overkill for the max 100hp shot I am planning to slowly climb up to....lol...Having said that, I am only interested in the REVO valves so I can safely do off the line launches with nitrous ...which is the MAJOR (if not only) reason for this kit purchase. The Jag just lags (even with the mods I have already done). I need a progressive nitrous hit that eases in rather than slams in all at once. I suppose as I learn more about the X2 I will see if I actually need the REVO units.

@Turbobox....I appreciate the patience and guidance

Still waiting for my kit to ship, so decided to start looking at locations for the Maxy. It looks like I found a perfect spot !!!. I made a cut-out with the dimensions given in the description of the MaxExtreme X2. I made the cut-out a bit larger but it still fit right into my center console. I think it will look sik when its is installed...check it out:

https://youtu.be/10bCXoj80-M

This week I will take a look inside the engine bay to see if I can relocate some wire harnesses and fuse boxes so I can check the plugs when I begin dialing in the nitrous shot.

So in modern Jaguar engines, I am reading there is no tach signal per se (if there is, please help me find it on my car...lol)

I know that I can get an RPM reading if I tap into the CAN Low wire, but will the controller be able to read the signal? or will I need to convert the signal to analog first with a CA BUS interface?

I am also wondering if I can use either the CAN Low wire to provide input to the R13 and R16 connection points??? If the MaxExtreme can decode the CAN Low signal, then it should be able to decode all the other signals coming from the OBDII port. I think this is something that WON should look into ...maybe adding a interface that can pull data from the OBDII port wires since all vehicles must send relevant data to OBDII for scanning and diagnostics.





Just got an email from DHL ...the kit arrives on Monday !!!!!!!!!! DaJagFather is starting to feel a little feverish....

You can also take signal from an ignition coil signal wire, cam signal, crank signal, etc.: there are various methods to gaining rpm signal.

Cars haven't had ignition coils for what..... 30 years? ..... lol.... maybe you are referring to coil on plug? that would mean tapping into all COP units? not really practical. As far as the RPM signal from the crank posistion senor or cam sensor...my ECU will throw a fit if those wires are tapped and I run the risk of frying the ECM module, so....no.

I am getting the RPM signal from a CAN BUS interface that pulls the tach. data packets and converts them to analog. From there I connect a wire to the maxE.

What I can't figure out is where to get input for the R13 and R16 connections on the maxE (the ECU and PWM inputs) and if I truly even need them?.

My question is will the controller accept and decode the CAN BUS data packets? Where have you got yours coming in from?

Considering that a $45 interface can pull the RPM signal from the CAN BUS and convert it to analog, I would like to think that a $700 nitrous control unit should be able to do something similar like convert or decipher the relevant data it needs from the digital data packets. Well, it would be nice at least...hahaha

I guess all I really need is the RPM signal, so I should be fine. From there the controller can do its job of ramping up the nitrous progressively. When I link the AFR wideband signal to it and the nitrous transducer, I should be relatively safe.

It would really..... really...really be nice like to find a way to use the controller to retard timing based on the amount of nitrous going in, so that is where I would like to get your advice on