NITROUS OXIDE ( nos / n2o ) advice forum

Hi all! I am fighting since years with my bike (zzr 1100) and the nitrous system - i am sure i have done a lot of mistakes but i am trying to solve them -
i modified my zzr1100 from carbs to efi - the stock generator is not powerful enough for fuel pump, efi and pulsoids and i think one of my problems is a weak spark because of low voltage if all systems are activated - i solved that with a stronger generator but still have problems - now i think the fuel tank ventilation (hope this is the right translation) seems to be too small - after activating the systems i feel the power for less then 1 seconds and then it seems to be i turned off ignition - its easy to solve this with a big whole in the cover - now i want to use only one strong fuel pump and two fuel regulators to feed both efi and nitrous system - i made a drawing and attach it to this post - does anybody has exeperience with such a setup? Can it work to use a 8bar (116psi) fuel pump to drive one regulator set at around 3bar (44psi) for efi and the second fuel regulator set at around 1 bar (15psi) - since now i found nobody who gave me a clear answer - if i use 2 fuelpumps i have again the problem with low voltage - sorry for my english (i am from Austria) and this stupid question -
Best regards
Manfred

Why don't you just use the 3 bar regulator and feed both the nitrous and Efi with it

the 3 bar pressure regulator is installed at the efi body - i cannot use it and i thing its not a good idea because constant pressure is needed at efi ...

that wont work. the system will default to the lowest pressure.. went down this road recently. you have to dead head off of the main fuel line AFTER its been through the main regulator. and you have to have a big ass pump that can make plenty more than what you need. and im not 100% sure, but i think to prevent pressure creep you have to have a bypass style main regulator. im not sure if the style that is in tank will work. i never tried it with that kind. just bought new stuff.

The fuel pump is not running at 8bar..

The line from the pump to the EFI body is also at 3bar so if you tap/ tee into that line you will have 3bar available at the fuel pulseoid as well..

As the the fuel pulseoid demands more fuel flow, the pressure regulator in the EFI body will react keeping the system pressure at 3bar (as long as the fuel pump can supply enough fuel FLOW).

The pump provides the fuel FLOW, the regulator in the EFI body regulates the fuel PRESSURE.

Thank you - during reading your posts i think i start understanding how it should work - the efi regulator is built in the efi body but at the fuel line between pump end efi i should always have around 3 bar - i only need a regulator without return line that reduces 3bar to around 1 bar - if possible adjustable! Is such a rgulator available and if yes can anybody provide information how to order it (link etc.)? Attached the new drawing - if i am wrong please come back to me!

You`d still be in the same situation?, the 1 bar regulator would blead fuel away from the 3 bar regulator giving you only 1 bar at your EFI fuel injectors? (depending on flow though your fuel pulseoid).

If you coul re-jet to allow you to run the fuel pulseoid at 3bar it would make it a lot simpler..

Will let Trev take over!.

To be fair I have no experience of "dead head regulators" but if you teed a 1 bar return style reg off the supply line to the 3 bar EFI rail and regulator it will bleed the WHOLE system down to 1 bar fuel pressure..

If the 1 bar regulator can bypass the total volume of fuel that the pump can supply then I can`t see how you would expect to still see 3 bar pressure at the other end of the T?.

The pump has NO PRESSURE, if the line from the pump was open ended it would just flow fuel out of the end with no pressure in the line, the FPR`s are variable restrictions that create pressure in the fuel lines an fuel rails.

Granted if the pump couldn`t flow enough to supply both pulseoid and EFI rail at full demand the fuel pressure will drop.

Hello Trevor! Nice to be back! I still have the problem that i must work in the garage without my workshop :-(
At the moment i am using a small "centrifugal fuel pump" - this pump do not need a regulator and need smuch less current then the big
high performance pump for nitrous only with extra fuel regulator - next step is that i must change from 4 pulsoids (2 for nitrous / 2 for fuel) to
only 1 for nitrous and 1 for fuel as they are also using "some" current :-)
at the moment i think the fuel tank ventilation whole is too small (around 2mm) because after activating i feel strong power increase and engine stops after less then a second - after looking back to all my activities the last years i never really tried to fix one problem - i always tried to fix all of them and that never worked! First of all i will drill a 8mm whole in the tank cover - i cant believe that i didnt think about that in the last years :-(
I thought there is an easy way to remove the small pump and use a second regulator for nitrous - but it´s not that easy - maybe its time to remove the whole installation and start from scratch - attached an old photo with the second fuel pump and regulator -
Regards
Manfred

could you remove the fuel rail and get someone to drill and tap or brase/weld a fitting into the end of the rail to use as a fuel take off like the shcrader valve on cars then just use one fuel pump and rejet the solenoids so match the new fuel pressure

my idea was to use seperate fuel pressure regulator for nitrous to make adjustments to f/a ratio e.g. if bottle pressure changes without changing the jets

If you upgrade to our Max V2, it offers AUTOMATIC mixture self adjustment for not only changes in nitrous pressure but ALSO ANY change.

It has ADJUSTABLE & AUTOMATIC self adjustment based on nitrous bottle pressure & it has ADJUSTABLE TARGET AFR which then maintains a CONSTANT AFR RATIO AUTOMATICALLY.

Trevor: it did not take much time to take a decision (i think just a few seconds!): i visit you end of August - with your help lets get out the best of the system and the bike :-)
I am looking forward seeing you and your team again :-)
All the best
Manfred

Sounds good to me Manfred, we'll show your buddies what brand of nitrous system is BEST.

Keep in touch between then and now and let me know as soon as you have a specific date for your visit.

See you again soon.

BTW the first (and last) time you had me work on your bike, something screwed up that we couldn't fix at the time and it stopped us completing the job, can you remember what that was?

Also there's a pic in those you linked me to of a spark plug. Is that the type you've been using and if so for how long? Also who advised you to use those?

oh yes - i remember the problem from my last visit: during the "unexpected" last testrun i run out of fuel and the engine gets nitrous only at wot -
i was lucky - only the head gasket was damaged but we could not finish - 1 or 2 years later i had again a fuel delivery problem -
engine runs much too lean and spark plugs/pistons melt -
after that i ordered pistons from you with much stronger crown and since that time i used that sparks -
i found them in internet for extreme race applications - NGK R0045J-10 - i never had that kind of problems again - even during very lean runs because of any other problems with electric, fuel delivery a.s.o. - the engine cannot be destroyed in any way now :-) but if you think these spark plugs are not good for nitrous i take any other according your advice!
i can mount the 4 pulsoids as you can see on the photo - put the fuel venoms into the 10mm whole where i have installed the nos foggers at the moment and with your help the tubes for nitrous - i will took all fuel pumps and regulators and all nitrous related parts i have with me :-)
I will update you from time to time before my visit and send you photos from parts and installation.
Best regards
Manfred

BTW Manfred we can improve on ALL that set up now as we've made substantial advances since you purchased that system and if you want to take advantage of that, we'll take your existing components back in PX, otherwise we'll just make the best of the components you have, which are still very capable.

that sounds great - the possibilities of the new controllers - checking A/F Ratio and nitrous pressure changing fuel/nitrous mix according to that - i need that :-)
I want that! i am counting the days :-)
Best regards
Manfred

Make sure you have a couple of sets of GOOD plugs (NGK 10s would be best) when you come as well Manfred, one set in the bike and a spare set.